Topic: 7/8" Scale Class A Shay Construction Series

[locodan]

Hi Russ,
That was a lot of drawing room with a double fold out so I could really show some details with all four views.
I left out the grate shaker because it is in the same location as the damper controls and would have only confused the drawing. I will show the grate shaker in a separate drawing later in the series.
Cheers Dan

[russ]

The issue of Live Steam in the Garden (July/August) with the first article in the series and with the plans of the loco is now  in print as I found it in my hobby shop in the Toronto, Ontario, Canada area yesterday. 

Russ

[locodan]

Hi Bill,
The copy will go to the printer next week, so a few weeks from now the issue will be mailed out.
Yep Pronto will work fine.
Cheers Dan

[gearedloco]

This is an interesting thread and sounds like a great project.  Any idea when the first article in the construction series will start?  I guess I'd better get my subscription request in pronto!

-bill

[locodan]

Hi all,
This project is not dead!!! It is on its way to the printer! The next issue #100 of "Steam in the Garden" will have a 10 page article on S/N 2800 the "Mapleton".

Do not be fooled by the scale I am building in which is small. The drawings in the series will be 7/8ths scale versions of the LLW prints. If you want to build a full size one this is the article for you! Any other scales will be possible with a patern maker. If Kozo's methods are used it is nice to work form true drawings to get a bit closer to the Lima part.

It took 8 pages of drawings with a double fold out to get all four views in 7/8ths scale, so the maybe it aain't all that small.

If you want to build a small ten ton Shay coal fired any scale subscribe to:
http://www.steamup.info/
Cheers
Dan Rowe

[southpass]

G,day Dan....have just been doing a bit of a search on the Nambour museum, apparently the loco is at present down in Ipswich at the railway workshops having a bit of work done on it. But I did find this site that has a bit of information.http://www.starfieldobservatory.com/MapletonTramway/27Gone.htm and some photo's. 2 pages on you will some more photo's of the Shays including factory shot.
I was at the Railway Museum http://www.theworkshops.qm.qld.gov.au/ a couple of months ago, but it must be in one of the back worksheds.
will post anything that I find, may be of some use.......John Baxter.

[locodan]

John, That is the one it was built from parts from both the Mapleton Shays 'Mapleton' and 'Dulong" and is now known as 'Shay'. I have most of the LLW drawings for this project but detail photos of the engine or trucks or any other detail part would be most welcome. I know for a fact that the draftsman and the pattern maker were not always on the same page.
Cheers Dan Rowe

[southpass]

G,day....I have been a member of this forum for a short time, but have not really got into construction yet. Mainly studying the work of members.
I missed this thread at start and only found it yesterday. I happen to live just a one hour drive from Mapleton ( beutifull hill country just behind the coast ). I first saw one of these Shays about 30 years ago when it was used in the play area of a school in Nambour. I did take some photo's at the time , but on checking them last night I found their quality has deteriorated to much to be of any good.
The last time I looked at the loco it was on a plinth in front of the Moreton Sugar Mill. 3 years ago after over 100 years of operation the mill was decomissioned and removed. I beleive the Shay has been relocated to the Nambout historical society grounds. For some time I have been promising myself a visit to check things out.
Don't know if this is the one you are modelling or its brother, but if there is any detail pictures you want I could see if they are posssible. We will be up in the next month or so. I go up there on a regular basis to watch the running days at the live steam clubs track.
Have a good day....John Baxter.

[locodan]

Ferd, I will be doing the casting myself, I will also ream the bores to 7/16" as the casting  fits in a 3/4" collet. That way I will know that the casting is a good one before it is shipped. This is the most complex casting for the project so I had to get way ahead of the curve. All the other castings at this point will be done with rubber molds with some of them using metal core pieces. I need to upgrade from a vacuum table to a vacuum box. I have the flasks for the vacuum box system which seals on the upper rim so all the flask is in the vacuum box. The flask have large holes in the sides with a cross on the bottom. This is a commercial jewelry set up, but they wanted way too much money for a simple metal box.

The mold was designed to make it simple to test casting a sleeve for the bore. This is not really necessary for this design because both ends have a cylinder covers bolted on. I would like to make a cylinder very close to the real LLW design someday and they all had solid bottoms for any engine smaller than 11x12. The cast in sleeve made of bronze or SS would make the idea of casting a true one piece cylinder feasible in 7/8" scale.
Cheers Dan

[Ferd]

Hi Dan
They look great - So you will be doing the casting in bronze yourself? or are you sending the foundry wax out for casting?

cheers Ferd

[locodan]

Hi All,
Here are the first wax cylinders. I have a few more modifications to the mold, but the results are very nice. The total length of the cylinder is just under one inch. The cylinder is designed for right or left use and it should fit in a 3/4" square collet to ream the bore. This project will be written up in Steam in the Garden starting in issue #100. http://steamup.info/  Online building suport and extra photos will be on this forum.
Cheers Dan

[Ferd]

Hi Dan
I will get the cad files to the waterjet cutter on Monday - sorry for the delay -  I have been swamped with work and have wanted to group it with a couple of frames I need done.
cheers Ferd

[locodan]

Hi all,
One of the major tasks for the Shay engine is the cylinder. I just finished the all metal mold for wax injection. This mold has full steam port cores. This will eliminate the need to use tiny milling cutters and drills to form the steam passages. I just made a pair of blue wax cylinders and they look really good. I will post photos of the wax cylinders this weekend.
Cheers Dan

[locodan]

Ferd and all,
I know that valve gear design is not everone's cup of tea, and most builders use an existing model design. I could have modified Kozo's valve gear design to fit the engine but it was more fun for me to modify the LLW design. I will get back to the subject soon.

It has just come to my attention that I am not really sure how much machining detail to include with the series. I was not really planing to give detailed instructions for every part of the build. I plan to have very good drawings and include both the actual LLW drawing  and the model drawing, if any changes are made.  That way advanced builders can make changes based on the real part.

I will use photos to show machine setup, but advice as what speed to run any machine tool depends on the size and power of the lathe or mill ect. in the builders shop. I have used a lot of ships lathes the 22" Leblond was my favorite. I will take good notes on my build and include all the special tooling that I or others have designed, I think that a good machinist book is better for spindle speeds. I at one time looked this type of stuff up, now unless I am machining a difficult meterial such as 410 chrome moly steel, I usually just wing it and adjust for conditions.

The boiler will be built with the article written by Kozo titled "Safety of Copper Boilers" this is in "Building the New Shay". The article is the best work I have ever seen on model copper boilers. It is based on the ASME boiler code which is more conservative than most model practice. Most of the US uses a modified form of the ASME boiler code that is regulated at the state level. Some states like Texas have exemptions for small manually fired boilers for hobby use but not all. I would not have considered a construction article before Kozo's boiler article. For those who need to show design work to club inspectors, they will be able to show Kozo's article which has all the ASME code references. This should with a valid hydro be enough for the nod of approval.

The trucks will be very close to the real design. Sevaral castings will be needed. I plan to only change the axle bearings to oil impregnated bronze for simplicity. They are hidden so it is a minor compromise. The gears will be from Stock Drive Products. Bevel gear cutting is difficult, I know how to do it with a shaper and a conical rotary generator designed by Bilgram, but commercial gears are a lot less work. (Yes that is the same Hugo Bilgram who invented my favorite valve gear diagram)

The frame will be simi-scale profile milled bronze or brass stock. I like bronze, must be my marine back ground. I think that the extra work is worth the effort, it is the small details like this that make an eye poping model or drawing.
Cheers Dan

[Ferd]

I just announced that I was going to start a Shay construction series and I have never built a locomotive.

Hi Dan
Sounds great to me - we never need to know anything as in reality everything we need we can research, ask or will know at that moment in time.  Einstein never knew his phone number, "why would I memorize something I can look up in a phone book" - building is the same a series of small parts made up of small steps, each of which is very simple and can be looked up at the time of needing.

I am looking forward to seeing this project start - I found most of the valve discussion beyond my mental attention span and I know all I need to do is build the parts you will be designing and I bet it works.

cheers Ferd
(highly impressed as to the level of research and information you have gathered.)